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 I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings

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swordandshield



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PostSubject: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 1:18 pm

Ive been called a sexist, misogynist and a bigot towards women on here and it is making me very angry because it is simply a misunderstanding. I am not prejudiced towards women at all. I love women, I think most of them are awesome and I talk to a lot of girls and don't hate them. I am simply only saying there are differences in the roles between men and women. We have different roles and duties. But here's a question, would you rather watch men's basketball or women's? If you think men play sports better, does that make you a bigot towards women? No of course not, it is simply what you prefer to watch. And also a woman cannot play men's football either because a 300 pound guy tackling her would crush her and probably kill the poor woman. I'm only saying there are things men are better at than women and there are of course things women are better at than men are. We each have our strengths and weaknesses. But I believe Yahuah (God) made us all equal despite gender. Now please stop calling me a misogynist!

And please don't lock this thread so I can't come back and defend myself if someone says something offensive or dumb.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 2:09 pm


(Velvet's exact response to someone making assumptions about her based on her gender. GIF courtesy of yours truly.)

Can we just drop it? Please?

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 2:21 pm

All hail the Goddess of might Velvet lol "bows"

Yeah we can drop it i just don't like being called a hateful person when I'm not. I know the truth about myself. And criticizing a video game character and saying that women IN the video games shouldn't fight or be on the front lines isn't the same as real life. Though Velvet looks like she can hold her own in combat. She kinda reminds me of Yuri from Vesperia.

Also i know girls in video games fight besides Velvet but they are usually mages and don't do any physical combat.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 4:35 pm

Assuming women can't do things that men can, assuming women can't play sports, assuming women can't fight is exactly what makes you those things.

You are a misogynist even if you try to deny it.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 5:58 pm

I never said women can't do things men can. They can but you don't see a woman boxing a male heavy weight champion do you? And women can play sports, but there's a reason why they play it seperately and not with the guys. I'm just thinking realistically and I said I believe God created everyone equal. If that is misogynistic, then so be it. Maybe you don't know what the word means. I don't know. I don't hate women.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:07 pm

You know the reason you don't see that stuff? It's because of men, not because women not wanting to do it. Men get so angry when women beat them at sports that they ban them from playing against men.

You are a misogynist for thinking that a women's role is for them to stay home to cook and clean. You say everyone is equal and yet you think women can't play against men.

This is also rather transphobic.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:27 pm

Yeah, there's a reason why in many sports women don't compete against men directly...The same reason that different weight classes in physical sports exist (or because of what Samael said, that's pretty awesome actually.) This problem doesn't exist in a fucking fantasy world, especially when characters have drastically different physical abilities (whether the character designer bases this on their gender or not) that could allow a faster fighter with a fucking demon arm to totally topple big man mcbeefcake.

The issue is that you are reinforcing bigoted perspectives of gender roles. You can say that you prefer watching mens' sports for totally valid reasons, I'm sure there are major differences in certain sports, but your original comment effectively stated that Velvet shouldn't be fighting period, that she should be cooking and cleaning. This is LITERALLY THE SAME as saying womens' sports shouldn't exist because you think men are better athletes so they should be housewives instead.


Moreover, why is this a problem now? Female fighters have existed in Tales games for decades, and IT'S THE GODDAMN TALES SERIES, IF YOU DON'T LIKE VELVET YOU CAN FUCKING PLAY AS ROKURO OR ANYONE ELSE. If anything the bigger issue is that Armitization limited your options of character choices in Zestiria compared to normal Tales games, if you wanted to play as a female character you would be stuck with Lailah and Edna having to play musical chairs whenever you needed to select a different element until Rose joins.


And I am going to count this as a second strike now, this is a discussion that didn't need continuing. I'm not going to lock this one, because I think your request to defend yourself is a fair one, but I think you're just digging yourself a deeper hole.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:33 pm

Ok well I'm sorry. I just prefer male MC's over female and its not cause I am a misogynist. Samael, you can think what you want about me, I personally could care less. The cooking and cleaning thing was basically a joke. Seems you guys can't take jokes. You need to lighten up. Sheesh.

Also, because I don't think exactly like you do means I am striked? Where in the forum rules does it say that? Could you please point that out to me? Thank you. You guys are like the liberals in the mainstream media who label conservatives and everyone who doesn't think like they do as bigoted or racist or what have you. It is retarded to say the least and just further divides people and this country.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:36 pm

Yeah ban this idiot. Please. I don't even care if I get in trouble for calling them that, it's a risk I'm willing to take.
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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:47 pm

Lol, i've been posting on this forum for years and because you don't like what I say I'm going to get banned? I generally get along with people here, you're all just ganging up on me now because I say men and women are different. Talk to a scientist and psychologist, he or she will confirm men and women are different. We think differently, we have a different body structure and anatomy, ect. But whatever, just dismiss fact from your liberal delusions.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Sun Dec 18, 2016 10:11 pm

We're not ganging up on you because you say men and women are different. Yes men and women are different, and if you actually knew anything you'd know there's more than just "men" and "women". You're saying sexist bullshit about women and trying to brush is off as a tasteless joke.

I am deeply offended at everything you are saying.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Mon Dec 19, 2016 12:07 am

We don't really have a need for a formal ruleset. This is 2016, netiquette is a generally understood concept. Common sense and human decency is all we really expect. Apart from this situation, the only other problem I recall having on the current iteration of this forum is that one asshole that continuously made irrelevant posts to complain about random voice actors for no reason, and that was literally all they posted, using several alts to do so.

We're pretty easygoing for the most part, and we've got a "forum games" sub-forum for random bullshit so that the other boards maintain an actual sense of discussion, but if someone goes out of their way to make a hate thread with no constructive criticism, you're gonna get a warning.

And again, this is 2016. That whole "oops everybody's mad at what I said, better pass it off as a joke" mindset doesn't work anymore. If you had made this thread as a simple apology instead of trying to defend yourself against TOTALLY valid criticism, then maybe we wouldn't be so hard on you, but even as a joke the ol' "make me a sandwich" routine is completely tasteless.

Also another piece of advice, when trying to back up an argument, don't bring religious or political views into it. This is the internet, we don't care what you believe on the inside, and don't assume that we're part of your country or political spectrum, all we care about is what your outward speech and actions say about you as a human being. You are sounding like the worst kind of politician right now, throwing around terms like "liberal delusions" while also throwing around your god's name and saying that you accept everybody.

You can say you believe in equality all you want, but your arguments lead us to believe that you don't understand what that really means.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Mon Dec 19, 2016 12:22 am

Ok I apologize for offending people, won't do it again.

As for cooking and cleaning, women tend to do that anyway and a better job than guys do at that. I think women are the caretakers and caregivers of the world. They generally have more compassion in their heart than guys do. So staying at home and taking care of the children isn't so bad for them. Of course in today's society, having a job is a must.

Anyway lets just drop this.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Mon Dec 19, 2016 5:08 am

Gender roles are a social construct. Men are raised to be men, and women are raised to be women. This is sad because it can be very limiting to people. Many men for example are scared to express emotion and compassion, because they will be looked down upon, since it's not "manly". And don't even get me started on women. Also being forced to do something just because you're good at it, is pretty tragic as well.

But yes, we should drop this. Like Taiyz said, it's 2016, almost 2017. Acting respectful and civilized (even online) should be common sense. Good thing you apologized, though.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:37 am

Yes they are but some social constructs are necessary for a society to function properly. The very notion of "gender" is also a social construct. I mean we are all human beings made of flesh and blood are we not? Well gender is also biological though.

Anyway can we just get along now please? Very Happy You should see me IRL I am polite and friendly to everyone lol

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:44 am

Race and ethnicity is also a social construct. I like to think there is only one race, the human race.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:59 pm

I do agree with everyone's comments, and I'd like to believe you honestly didn't get the situation. I want to clarify so you understand that people do not hate you per se, what you say was just deeply hurtful. Misogynist isn't generally used as "woman hater" as much anymore, more so the prejudice against women (means based on the fact that they are women) aspect. Which saying things like women cannot do X because they are women...is very much exactly that.

I think you honestly want to get along and that's great! I am sure you are polite and friendly, everyone wants to get along too, they just see you saying some things and they know better/differently because of their experiences and knowledge of the world, so they cannot see where you are coming from.

For your latest point though, Sex is biological, gender is psychological. Gender roles are absolutely a human thing, but that doesn't mean there are only two genders or only the one you are deemed at birth. Imposing the roles of the gender they are not on a person has devastating consequences. It is a sensitive topic and it should be treated with dignity, a lot of lives have been lost because of gender and sex, so I do agree that things like the sandwich jokes are out of line coming from that context.

It is also true that we impose extra gender roles, on top of the comfortable one, those are the ones that vary by society, and they can be extremely harmful, women are gravely restricted almost universally and men are encouraged to form or exaggerate unhealthy behaviours. In example, cisgendered males are more likely to be physically aggressive, very much so, that does not make it right. That is because dangerous behaviours can be moderated in a healthy way, but western culture does the opposite and can encourage it as something "stereotypically manly" you must be this way if you are a man. And this is just not fact. There are natural differences, and that's probably how division got set up, but we are not restricted to that, nor should it be continued when we know for a fact it is unhealthy, unneeded, and unproductive.

Race may be a construct (I would argue that it is not exactly, but one day may be), but it is used to hurt people, and as long as that happens we cannot all happily be one race. If people are discriminated against based on it, it is useful to identify it and realize that it is happening that these people are oppressed based on a distinguishing trait(s). Its a lovely sentiment and I totally agree with you on that, I am just offering a point as to why some may have a problem with the view, because it does not serve its purpose.

I also found what you said hurtful, it hits me on a deep level, but I think you did not intend that. I do hope we can (continue) to be friends.

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Tue Dec 20, 2016 8:36 am

Of course we can be friends still. Very Happy To be clear, I wasn't saying a woman can't do this or that because she's a woman. Just because you have different private parts than your male counterpart doesn't mean you can't do whatever you want. We're all woven from the same thread as human beings. I will say that men generally have more upper body strength than women and can generally lift heavier weights at the gym but that doesn't mean women are weak or that they are somehow weaker than men. I make this point because my dad told me that they generally have more upper body strength, maybe he is mistaken. I know a lot of women can swim faster than men and are more agile depending on her body type. I'm not going to marginalize women and say they are weaker than men because if a woman works out at the gym, she can build big muscles too. Also having a strong physique depends not really on gender but on genetics. So yeah.

I know you can be a misogynist and still like women sexually and be attracted to them. Kind of like those wife-beater hillbilly redneck types. I have zero respect for them.

I meant no offense in all my posts, I was just being ignorant in some of my points I was trying to make. I wasn't trolling or being offensive. I'm still young and trying to acquire more experience in life and to make life better for myself. I'm just your average guy. I work part time and go to school a few days a week right now, not grade school but tradeschool to be a graphics designer. I have some life experience but not a lot because I don't go out much lol. That'll change in due time as I work to better my life, find my soulmate (shes out there somewhere!), ect.

There are gender roles as by social construct, also, for me it is a spiritual aspect. According to my beliefs in Yahuah and who follows Yahushua's teachings. But I won't get into that. I will say that as for bonding in marriage or a relationship both the man and woman are to submit to one another in unity and serve each other rather than only the man or woman serving the other. This is unlike Islam where the woman is submissive and the man is dominant because Islam teaches that women are inferior to men. Also from their cultural standpoint that plays a factor over there in the arabic countries that women are second-class citizens kind of like how Imperial Japan was during WW2 with their macho man culture.

Anyway, I do wish to drop this topic. I know not everyone is going to agree with me (or my dad for that matter lol) so there is no real point in discussing things further or else this will turn into a flame-topic which I initially signed up and posted on this forum because nobody flames each other here or calls people derogatory names. If you disagree with me, let's agree to disagree and just don't start any drama or just say you disagree and let this thread die. Don't make these big huge posts and keep the discussion going. >.>;

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PostSubject: Re: I want to clarify a few things and misunderstandings   Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:29 pm

Of course, I apologize for the lengthy message! I saw you may have been ignorant of some things so I wanted to provide you with some information you could look back on when in doubt if you get less favourable reactions anytime else.

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